Interview with Mirjana in Medjugorje

A talk (question and answer session) given by Mirjana in the Oasis of Peace on 3rd October 2009

Q: Has Our Lady said anything about other apparitions?

Only about Fatima. She said, “What I have started in Fatima I will finish in Medjugorje. My heart will triumph.” I cannot go into details. That’s the only apparition she mentioned aside from Medjugorje.

Here is the entire transcript.

Mirjana: We will start our meeting with one Hail Mary. Queen of Peace, Pray for us.

We have gathered so that you may ask whatever you may be interested in. Anything that can help you to understand Medjugorje, and if I know, I will be so glad to respond to you because I desire with my entire heart that you may understand what Our Lady desires from us. The first thing is, she invited you. She needs apostles. That’s why feel free to ask anything that can help you.

Q: Yesterday’s message was very serious and very sad, can you elaborate a little bit?

Message was very sad and you were lucky because you did not have a chance to see the expression on Our Lady’s face so that your heart breaks. Because she is mother, and as she said in one of her messages, she desires to bring all of us as the most beautiful bouquet of flowers to her Son. Once she realises that we do not see, we do not understand that, she is the way she was yesterday. Talking about her message, I have no right to comment on the message because I received it the same way you did. Same like you, I also have to reflect on message in order to understand what it tells me. But I would like to ask you one thing. Yesterday when I talked with some people about message, most people said ‘when shall this world change, when shall the world understand?’ but no one said ‘when shall I understand, when shall I change myself?’ I am only asking from all of you to start from ourselves to see where we make mistake and what we can change. Once we change, it will be easier to change others, not always put the blame on others. We should start with ourselves.

 

Q: She said her heart was seizing?

I also say that my heart seizes when I see her so sad. Our Lady had a very sad expression on her face, filled with pain because she was looking at us and we know what she was able to see within us..

Q: Do you always see her or sometimes just hear her voice?

On the second of every month, I have normal apparition. I can hear her and I can see her.

Q: There are groups around saying we can go to heaven through other religions. How does Jesus see that? How does Mary see that?

When Our Lady asked me to pray for unbelievers, then my question was ‘who are unbelievers?’ and she said all those who do not feel church as home and God as their Father. If you look at our Lady’s messages further, Holy Mass is in the first place, and then confession, communion, etc., which is part of the Holy Catholic church. But is not me who is supposed to decide. I can only repeat what Our Lady says. Very often she would say, we can possess anything in this world but if we do not have peace we have nothing. And the only true peace is the one my Son gives.

Q: How can I be a true apostle to others?

If you live Our Lady’s messages, and if you follow her, it means you are walking up to Jesus. And then your life will be story. Others will see in you what they are looking for because Our Lady doesn’t want us to preach. I’m not talking about priests here (points to a row of priests and laughs) but she would like from us to talk with our own life. So that every unbeliever can see that something within ourselves. What did I mean about that? Let me give you a cute example from a very little thing.

I was here at evening Mass in Medjugorje. I couldn’t sit down and I have a problem with my back. I noticed a little space in one of those benches and I sat down. But all around were Italians (laughter) and all of them started yelling at me ” stand up, that is our bench, we were first one to come, etc.” I stood up and kept quiet. Later a lady who recognised me was passing by and then after that they wanted to give me the whole bench to sit. But why am I saying this?

Imagine if I were an unbeliever and for the first time I desire to enter into a Catholic church to see what is that all about. And Catholics, who say they know the love of God welcome me in that way. Would I ever enter again there? And whose responsibility would that be? That is what Our Lady says, that we have a great responsibility. Only love. That is the answer to everything. Our Lady says that we cannot consider ourselves as true believers if we do not see Jesus Christ in every single person we meet. That is the hardest thing but we have to reach that point.

Q: Have you received a message from Our Lady about forces fighting wars?

That is already question you are supposed to ask from a priest because I am just a visionary and I can only say what Our Lady says to me. I do not know anything else. I as a visionary also ask help from a priest because I am just like you.

Q: Has the question been asked?

No.

Q: Isn’t it selfish to just petition for ourselves to change?

I do not pray for myself. I pray for my family but I only say ‘my family in your hands’. I just say we in your hands because you (God) know what is the best for us when I pray. I pray the most for unbelievers because that is where we all are.

Q: When we are trying to change ourselves according to our Mother’s messages, what about the little nagging self doubts we have?

My personal opinion, we can always do better, we can always be better people, we can always pray better and we grow in that. I always recommend to everybody, do not waste your time judging yourself in your own prayer. Pray and God will help you. Sometimes you just feel like you prayed great, sometimes not, but Our Lady always offers her hand as Mother and she will always raise you up. Do not forget, God is love, and He loves you, and He knows you, and it is important that you desire to come closer to Him and He will help you.

Q: I have a hard time saying the rosary. Would you help us to know when you are praying the rosary, are you supposed to think of the words ? My mind wanders while I’m doing that.

Our Lady asks from us to pray with heart. I understand that to mean that every word that comes out of my mouth would pass through my heart first. So, if I say Hail Mary, then I truly with heart greet Mary. Full of grace, that I may feel within myself how much grace Our Lady gives me and to everyone. It is never a repetition for me because I always feel some new different things when I pray Hail Mary. For example, when I reflect on Our Lady was assumed into Heaven, I think about her. I talk with her. I ask her about how she felt, all that she thought. I do not see her, I do not hear her, but just with heart. Try that. If your thoughts still wander, put the rosary aside and talk with Our Lady and tell her why is that so. What is a burden, why you can’t be still and pray. Whatever you have in your heart, give it to her.

Q: When Jesus said ‘many are called but few are chosen’ I’m not quite sure what He meant by that.

Mirjana smiled and said; We could talk this whole afternoon about what He meant. I like to talk a lot but if we start this topic now we will never end ! You said it. Many are called, few are chosen. What do you think why that is so, because Jesus said that to me and to you, so everyone has his own opinion about it. Even here, everyone is invited but how many will understand and how many of them will become true apostles? I do not know.

Q: What did Our Lady mean when she said this is a time of grace?

Isn’t this a great grace? This immense love of God to send us His mother for so many years, to understand and to take the right path. Doesn’t that show how much God loves us?

Q: Have you or any of the other visionaries ever met with the Holy Father?

It was me. Others were jealous. (laughter). I was in St Peter’s Basilica in Vatican with all other pilgrims. I was with an Italian priest. So Pope was walking by and he was blessing. He blessed me and just passed by. The priest with me said, “Holy Father, this is Mirjana from Medjugorje,” and he came back and blessed me again. Then he left. And I said to priest, most likely he thought just I just need a double blessing (laughter). In the afternoon, we received a note to go to Castelgondolfo, close to Rome, the next day. And me and him were alone together and among other things he said to me, “I know everything, I have been following everything. Ask pilgrims to pray for my intentions. Keep Medjugorje because Medjugorje is the hope for the entire world.”

A priest told me that from the very beginning, Pope was very fond of Medjugorje because two months before the apparitions in Medjugorje started, Pope was praying to Our Lady to come again on earth. He said, “I cannot do it all alone because Yugoslavia, Czechoslovakia, Poland, etc., all communist. I cannot do it on my own. I need you.” And later he heard that in Yugoslavia, communist country, in a little village, Our Lady appeared and he said, “That is response to my prayers.”

Q: Mirjana, how beautiful is Our Mother?

That is not only superficial beauty that you see from outside. That is something that is radiating out of her. As children, we asked Our Lady a childish question. We said, how come that you are so beautiful? She said, “I am beautiful because I love.” And she said “My children, if you want to be that beautiful, then love.” At that time when that apparition happened, Jakov was only nine and a half years old. So when Our Lady left, he said, “I think that she wasn’t saying the truth.” We all said, “How can you dare to say that our heavenly Mother is not saying the truth.” He said, “Yes, but look at us visionaries, some of us can love until the end of our loves but we’ll never be as beautiful as she said” — because he did not understand what kind of beauty Our Lady was speaking about. But even today he doesn’t understand many things. (laughter).

Q: Before Our Lady comes, do you have dream or some other feelings?

I never dream of Our Lady, never. Usually that is something that you get excited about during the day, that’s what you dream; but I never dreamed of Our Lady. I always prepare myself the day before by fasting and prayer and night before apparition, I spend in prayer. So then I cannot dream. I don’t think of anything else because it is impossible. I just desire to pray because only that way I will have peace, and only that way I am capable to wait until tomorrow comes. I think it is all God’s help because without God’s help we would not be able to live a normal life. Let me give you an example. I’m a mother and I have two daughters and as every normal mother, I would give my life for them, but when I am with Our Lady, my daughters do not exist. There is only the great desire that she would take me with her. You can only try to imagine what a pain it is when Our Lady leaves. I simply do not even have strength to keep a pencil or pen in my hand. Thanks be to God for Miki, he writes it down and I just go straight to my room to pray. Then I pray for one hour, two or three, depends. And through this prayer, God gives me the strength to understand, and to go forward.

Q: When you say you pray, is it always the rosary or talking ?

It is rosary, seven Our Fathers, talking, but I always pray rosary of St. Anthony because he is my dearest saint (lots of people went ahh), because St. Anthony is the only saint that you can make deals with (laughter), ‘you do that for me and I’ll do that for you.’

Q: Mirjana, how come you didn’t become a nun?

At the very beginning when we were children, we asked Our Lady, “What do you desire from us, from our life?” She said, “Whatever you feel in your heart. If you decide to be priest or nun I desire that it is visible that I was with you. And if you decide to have families, I desire that you try your best to be an example to the other families.” And that is all she ever said about my personal life. Everybody asks me that. Then I read about Bernadette to see what happened to her. She didn’t want at all to become a nun but they forced her to. But we live in a different time now and so we were not forced to.

Q: What does Our Lady say about division in families? (Question not completely audible)

I believe that Our Lady doesn’t have to talk about it because if you keep the vow before God… Here, when we get married in the church, we put our right hand on the Cross so that God may help me, so there’s no divorce. If its good, then thanks be to God. If not, then just take your cross. Because you cannot be only partially Catholic. You are or you are not. Saddest thing is we Catholics try to justify things that cannot be justified. We are or we are not. We follow Jesus or we do not follow him.

Q: What is it like for you to be present at another visionary’s apparition, for example, Jakov at Christmas?

I never, that would be too painful knowing what he is looking at and I cannot. While he is having apparition for example, I will pray in my room and (anyway) he would be teasing me afterwards! (laughter)

Q: So divorce is not acceptable?

Of course. Husband can leave wife and wife can leave husband, but she is his wife and he is her husband. If my husband for example leaves me, I would not be able to look for another husband because he is my husband before God. What God binds once, only He can separate. I cannot force my husband to be with me but even if he leaves, he still remains my husband.

Q: And annulment?

Pointing to a row of priests Mirjana says, Here is the priests! (laughter). I am not planning to divorce, that’s why I am not interested in annulments. I know that if you did not tell about some illness you may have, or if you do not want to have children, it could be an excuse. Then Church will give you an annulment, if that’s the case, as far as I’ve heard, but I never questioned too much about it. After a pause and with a broad grin she added: But if I get interested in that, then I will ask (laughter).

Q: Do your children know what is happening and how do they react to all of that?

They are 18 and 15 years old and they know very well what’s happening. Me and Marko always tried to bring them closer to God ever since they were born. We thought if they have a sense of God’s love they will understand the apparitions. Then we explained to them that from time to time Our Lady chooses some people not because they are the best but because in that moment, she needs such people. And they look at me as a normal person. We all ..(inaudible) ..only God. That is the way they …(inaudible)..When I talked about responsibility of parents, our children look at our own life. Some example of my older daughter Maria; When she was about 2 years old, I did not talk to her about apparitions because I thought she was too young to understand. But one day while she was playing with her friend in the room, I was watching over. Then I heard this other girl say, “You know my mum drives a car.” My daughter Maria remained quiet for a moment and said, “Big deal, my mum talks to Our Lady every day.” So without even saying a word, she understood.

Q: Emotionally speaking, if you had to use one word to describe how you feel when you in the presence of the Mother of God, what word would you use?

That is heaven. They ask me did I see heaven and I say I did not see heaven but to be with Our Lady is to be in heaven. They ask me, did you touch her, did she touch you? I never even felt a need to do that because when she is looking at you, she is embracing you and kissing you. You simply feel you don’t want it ever to stop. The greatest love on earth beside love for God is love for your children. Imagine when you do not even think about your children, you forget that they exist — only Our Lady, so she may look at you. I think that would be like in heaven.

Q: What lesson are we supposed to learn from fasting?

Again, I can just tell you my own personal opinion. When I’m fasting, I’m proving to myself that I am the boss of my own body and that I can do for God anything I want. That nothing can stop me. And with this fasting, I’m showing to God that with this little, I am ready to do even more if that is what He desires. Through fasting my prayer is stronger. I feel closer to Him. Again, that’s just my own personal feelings.

Q: Has Our Lady said anything about Garabandal?

Only about Fatima. She said, “What I have started in Fatima I will finish in Medjugorje. My heart will triumph.” I cannot go into details. That’s the only apparition she mentioned aside from Medjugorje.

Q: Some of you visionaries have public apparitions and some of you have private. Does Our Lady give that to you as a choice?

There is no private apparitions because Our Lady doesn’t come (just) to me or Jakov or Maria, she comes to the entire world. Lets take Ivan as an example. He has the apparitions in the Chapel and then not everybody can fit in so he does like one day for priests, one day for families, one day for sick people so that everyone can more or less fit in. I never had any private apparitions. I do not even know what it means.

Q: Is there conflict with the Bishop here? What is that about?

The greatest authority is Pope, and the way Pope says, everybody should obey. The latest commission we had here in Medjugorje was before the war, that was when the war started, that was when the Bishops Conference of ex-Yugoslavia said that pilgrims are allowed to come to Medjugorje, that priests will accept them and they will provide Masses for them, confessions, etc. But decision about whether Medjugorje is authentic or not, that will take time. The latest thing is that Medjugorje simply went outside the frame of our Diocese and that it will go into hands of Vatican.

Q: Is it like a suffering for Mary to come on the earth, for us not to be converted?

Its not painful. She is mother. You are young, most likely you are not married? (questioner replies ‘no‘) Once you have your own children, no matter what they do, you will run after them and try to help them because that is mother. Same as with Our Lady.

Q: On your last daily apparition, I read that you had a long conversation with Our Lady about heaven?

We were talking about secrets. That was my last daily apparition, that is when Our Lady gave me that last secret and then she explained that I wasn’t to have her daily apparitions anymore. And she explained to me the way I’m going to have them now (from then onwards) and on that apparition, Christmas 1982, we did not talk about heaven. On one occasion, I asked Our Lady, “How come God is love and He loves us so much and He put some people for eternity in hell?” She said, “It is not God who decided that, it is people who decided to go there.” I do not think I talked about anything else with Our Lady. Maybe you read about Marija or Vicka.

Q: This question concerned a marriage partner being an unbeliever. The actual question although just audible was posed by someone whose English was not clear.

I think you forgot, I am just a visionary. Its usually like (this) that husband is unbeliever. That is why God put her husband in her way, so he is her responsibility. She needs to help him to come to know God and God’s love, not through criticising, judging or forcing, but simply through her love, her example, and her prayer. That is the only way.

Q: Did Our Lady ever share with you about what is the more terrible sin?

She didn’t talk with me what is greater or lesser sin, but only what we should do to avoid sin. And she didn’t tell me about which sin is more or less. What comes to my mind right now, for me personally, the greatest sin is not to have love towards your neighbour. Because when you have love for your neighbour, you will not kill, you will not steal, you will not deceive. You will not do anything bad because you will have love within you. That is what I personally think.

Q: The sign that will appear in Medjugorje, I read that when that appears and if you have not converted, it will be too late.

(I think Mirjana may have misunderstood the nature of this question as evidenced by her reply)

That is not true. Our Lady said like this: “This is the last time I visit earth in this way.” Now this would be my personal opinion, what she meant with that: these many years, many visionaries, but I never thought that she would be last time on earth That is wrong interpretation. Same as in one of her messages, Our Lady said, “I am giving you my motherly blessing but from today on, you are that blessing.” But many people misunderstood that and now they go out and they bless people. That is not what Our Lady intended to say. She intended to say that our life should become a blessing for other people because only priests are supposed to bless. She said their priestly hands are blessed by my Son. And we visionaries, we cannot bless. I always ask pilgrims, don’t ask me to do that. I cannot bless anyone except my own children and that is my motherly blessing, because I also need blessing from a priest.

Q: How did you convince your family to follow you?

I lived with my parents in Sarajevo and I came to spend summer vacation here. I’m always kidding with visionaries when I say Our Lady was waiting for me to come (laughter). So when apparitions started, my aunt called my mum by phone and she didn’t know how to tell that to her. My mother thought that I am in hospital, that I’m dying but my aunt said, “No, its not about that ! She just says that she sees Our Lady.” My mother said, “Is she normal to you?” (laughter). My aunt said, “She looks the same like before.” Then mum said, “There must be something happening with her.” They came right away from Sarajevo. Who knows you the best? –your parents. So they were with me from the beginning, they helped me. As I told you, I was not from here. I was forced to go back to Sarajevo right away and then I had hardest time. Because here, all around we have Catholics and Croats. In Sarajevo very few Catholics, most are Muslims or Orthodox. It wasn’t my choice to go back to Sarajevo. As we lived in Sarajevo, every single day, police was in our home. It was terrible time for years and my father just told me, you just go on, say the truth, be not afraid, God will help us. And that is how it truly was. God helped us but it wasn’t easy. There was only me, my mother, father and brother and everybody else separated from us because it wasn’t good to be with us in communism. I was only fifteen years old and I was state enemy and then out of fear, no one wants to be close to you.

Q: Why do you think the Virgin Mary chose you as a visionary?

Can’t you see? (laughter). I’ve been talking for an hour and you ask me that question! (laughter). Mirjana said in English, “I’m joking, I’m joking”

If you desire to be an example to unbeliever, if you desire to show that you have faith, that we have love, then you have to smile. You have to joke, you have to show that you have God. If you’re always worried, nervous, serious, then an unbeliever will say, “She’s not any different to me. Why would I change?” That’s why I prefer to joke. Why did Our Lady choose me? On one occasion, we asked her, why six of us, because we were the same as every other child here. All she said was, “Because I need you six the way you are.” And all six of us are different individuals, only Our Lady could put us together. I always remember words of late Fr. Slavko, a priest who passed away on the Cross Hill. He was my husband’s uncle. He was coming to our home all the time. One day he came very upset and I said, “What happened, what made you angry?” He said, “How can you ask me something like that, for if I were Our Lady, I would never choose six of you. For me the greatest sign that Our Lady is truly present here is the fact that she chose six of you.” Because poor Fr Slavko, for six months he tried to gather six of us together at same time. He didn’t make it!

Q: What has Our Lady said about purgatory?

Our Lady is asking from us to put in our daily prayers the souls in purgatory and to offer Masses for them. Not to go to the rectory, not to pay for the Mass, but to be present during that Holy Mass and to pray during that Holy Mass.

Q: Does Our Lady ever discuss war?

No

Q: Why are we not allowed to know the secrets until a certain time?

That is God’s will. I never think about secrets. I don’t even think about it, because it is dear God who keeps the secrets and His will be done. For example this morning, I spoke to Italians , maybe you saw there was thousands of them! (laughter). Any and every question they asked started with why, why, why, why this, why that, waving their hands. Then I said to them, “You know why Our Lady did not appear in Italy but in Croatia, and they said again ‘why?'” (laughter). I said if she appeared in Italy she would run away after 3rd day (laughter) because it would always be ‘why, why, why?’. Whatever she said, we just accepted it the way it is. I never said ‘why’ because whatever Our Lady says, that is for our good and it is not up to me to ask why.

Q: Our Lady gave you her autobiography?

Vicka.

Q: When will that be shared with us?

Mirjana just smiled and replied, “Ask Vicka.”

Q: What can you do to help people who live different lifestyles to change their lives?

I would just pray for them. I put them in God’s hands and I pray for them because I feel sorry for them, because they simply go against nature, and nature was created by God, so that it means you go against God. Mirjana said in English, “Everything what you are doing with your heart will help. It’s important that you doing with your heart.” Its beautiful that you are worried for them so much. That means that you love your neighbour and I’m glad that there is no judgements in your words, only love. And that is what Our Lady desires from us, not to judge but to love them and to pray for them.

Q: Has your husband ever doubted your word?

He would not remain alive if he doubted (laughter). My husband comes from a Catholic family, he’s Fr. Slavko’s nephew. The two of us grew up together. We know each other from birth. He said, “When the apparitions started, as soon as they told me that you are involved, I believed immediately.” Because we know each other from birth. I was a good girl! (laughter). Let me give you an example. In Sarajevo we Catholic children would secretly go to the catechism. It would always be one mother who would take four or five of us. I was about six years old. My mum told me, “If someone along the way stops you and ask where are you going, tell them that we are going to have an ice-cream or something else.” And one particular day, my teacher who was communist, was walking by and she asked me, “Where have you been?” I was supposed to lie to her. I looked at her and said, ” I truly have no idea where I have been. ” (laughter). I couldn’t say I was shopping or buying an ice-cream or something, so the best way was to say I didn’t know.

We will finish now. We’ll finish with Hail Mary, and we have so many priests with us; they didn’t help me so much with questions, (laughter) but they can still give us blessing.

Vatican Criteria for Judging Medjugorje

By Fr. Tomislav Pervan, OFM
Former Pastor of Medjugorje (1982-1988), former Provincial of the Franciscans (OFM) in Hercegovina (1994-2001).

For the past twenty-five years, Medjugorje has been an actuality on the world scene. Today, it has its zealous advocates; however, it also has its fierce opponents. Opposing front lines in the battle are not likely to sue for peace any time soon. Advocates are tireless in their visits to Medjugorje all the while believing the authentic voice of Heaven is the starting point, namely, the appearance of the Gospa – Our Lady. Meanwhile, the opponents are fierce in their opposition and seek out elements of contention surrounding the entire set of events.

In the meantime, the ever-increasing daily flow of pilgrims to this place does not allow us to be indifferent. Facts and numbers speak for themselves. The number of pilgrims is ever increasing. They come from all corners of the earth, are of all colours of skin, and from all nations and nationalities. While other places of pilgrimage mark a decrease in pilgrims and pilgrimages despite being advertised widely, the number of pilgrims and faithful of all languages and locales constantly increases. As a phenomenon, Medjugorje does not have an active propaganda machine: individuals spread its fame by word-of-mouth, witness, and personal experience.

On the one hand, the priests who work in Medjugorje feel they are over-burdened in their daily work and that they are stretched to their physical limits. They are faced with innumerable calls for personal counseling, endless confessions, and constant evangelization. On the other hand, they are also faced with the suspicion that they are teetering at the edge of heterodoxy. The constant criticism is hurled at them that they are fostering something that is contrary to the Church, namely, the non-existent apparitions and the like. We, on the other hand, cannot fail to speak, fail to give witness about that which we have heard or seen, or that which we experience daily by way of our senses. (Cf. Acts 4:20) Hence, we invite all to come and see. So many bishops and priests had their doubts; however, after many hours of hearing confessions, they changed their minds and the doubts vanished.

The voice of conscience forces upon us the obligation to be of assistance to those who are in misery and who come here. We wish to be in harmony with the Church to the very end, and not to sin against the Church’s teachings or practice. Meanwhile, the accusations and reproaches hurt. Quite frequently, questions are raised that ask: What need did we have of all of this? Were we not able to be as every other parish, that is, carry out the well-entrenched pastoral patterns within the usual norms of the Church and Gospels? Who was it that cooked this stew, such that, to this very day, the river of pilgrims has not dried up, but, to the contrary, continues to grow greater and more dynamic?

For this reason, and as a friend and participant of these events from their beginnings in 1981, I give consideration to what must be done to change the present situations to escape the entrenched position of persistent denial, constant disputation, or, in fact, indifference and silence on the part of the Church’s media all of this while the flow of thousands of pilgrims to this place continues. It is obvious that all the denials, disputations, and silence find no acceptance on the part of the faithful. Meanwhile, Church circles continue to be deaf, and the prohibition against this activity on the part the faithful persists on the part of the media.

It is the inner voice of conscience and the experience of faith that motivate the faithful. I am convinced that the Holy Spirit Himself is the initiator of all these events. I am further convinced that, after twenty-five years have passed, the principle of the locus theologicus (the theological position), according to the notion of the sensus fidelium (understanding on the part of the faithful) and the consensus fidelium (unanimity of the faithful), applies as offered for acceptance by the documents of Vatican II and post-Vatican II, and by statements of Popes following the Council. Things we read about in the Acts of the Apostles are happening here. I am convinced that the Church is being gathered in this place from the four winds and every corner of the earth into the one Kingdom as what took place in Jerusalem at Pentecost. In this place, we find mirrored the universal – “Catholic” Church in miniature.

It is in this sense that I believe the instruction of the Congregation for the Faith entitled, The Criteria for Judging and Differentiating Revelations and Apparitions, dated the 27th of February, 1978, and signed by the then Prefect, Francis Cardinal Seper, should serve as the vade mecum (that is, the constant companion, the manual) when considering, passing judgment upon, and making decisions about Medjugorje and the Medjugorje phenomenon. The text has lost nothing of its immediacy and value to this very day. It can be fully applied to the events of Medjugorje with all its implications. It can examine the events of Medjugorje from the positive or negative side with all the arguments presented pro and con.

The Congregation for the Faith in its instructions reduces to three levels, or degrees, the norms that relate to reactions to alleged apparitions.

The seers must be examined to determine if, perhaps, it is a question of self-styled visions. Then, all the messages must be gathered and examined and viewed from the point of view of the degree of education of the seers. The mental and physical state of the seers must be examined thoroughly, as well as their moral integrity. All that is explainable from the purely human point of view must be taken into consideration; however, by the same token, all that cannot be explained in purely human terms and with the aid of the most contemporary psychological or physical sciences, and which, in the end, has no cause within human power, must also be taken into consideration.

Following the first phase, if the matter has not died on its own, has not come to a halt or fallen into oblivion, the principle ad experimentum (for the purpose of experiment) comes into play. At the same time, of course, it must be emphasized that the employment of this principle in no way suggests or recognizes the authenticity of the alleged apparitions. It simply channels events to proper and healthy Church routine: practices regarding prayer, devotions, the sacraments, constant spiritual growth and holiness.

When an appropriate period of the ad experimentum phase has elapsed, and in the light of experiences, especially after a close examination of the spiritual fruits occasioned by the alleged apparitions, and of the devotional practices surrounding them, a competent judgment of the events must be given if circumstances demand it.

As regards the first point, everything can be reduced to a simple conclusion: To the present day, in the entire history of the Church, no Marian apparitions were so intensively and extensively investigated (from 1984 – 2005) on the part of numerous and independent qualified, international experts in the fields of medicine and psychology, or whose investigations and their results were found to correspond to and compliment each other. All of the experts concluded that the subjects investigated were found to be spiritually, psychologically, and physically healthy individuals. They were found not to be hallucinating, subject to confabulation, (auto) suggestion, hysteria, hypnotic or other loss of consciousness, deceit, suggestion or exterior inducement of any sort. Hence, it is irresponsible to publicly proclaim them to be liars or inventors of false visions and messages.

Many experts from the fields of medicine, psychology, and parapsychology have occupied themselves with the Medjugorje seers. They failed to uncover any sort of pathological deviation from the norm in their lives. The scientific experts are capable of reaching the full limit of their tests. However, once they have arrived at that limit, their ability to explain ceases. They are able to discern what does or does not pertain to medicine and pathology and what must be excluded from a medico-psychological perspective. The experts have done so and have left behind a record of their findings. Because of that, and because of intellectual honesty, we, who have regard for the truth, must take their investigations and judgments as to the phenomena of Medjugorje into serious account.

The convergent proofs in favour of the authenticity of the Medjugorje phenomenon are perceptible when one takes into consideration the theological, sociological and scientific experiments carried out upon the seers by French, Italian, and Austrian teams of experts from 1984 through 2005. According to the theologian and Mariologist, R. Laurentin, who has published works of capital value (17 books) on Lourdes, and has thoroughly investigated the apparitions in Medjugorje, the latter give evidence of being more powerful as regards the proof of their authenticity than those in Lourdes, to which the Church gave its formal approval.

According to the teaching of St. Ignatius on discernment of spirits, the causes of those or similar manifestations can be determined to be purely human, divine, or demonic. Effects must always be judged by their cause. In all that took place in Medjugorje, one must ask what the cause was, or where the causal beginnings had their roots. If we take into consideration the first days of the events that took place in Bijakovici in June and July of 1981, the experts who thoroughly examined the seers concluded that the seers had some sort of fundamental and key experience, some initial encounter that put them into the center of something that they could not begin to imagine or foresee, something against their will or inclinations, something they were scarcely able to predict.

Science as such can neither confirm nor deny whether the Gospa is, or is not, appearing, (just as it would not have been able to utilize scientific instruments to register the resurrection of Christ were they to have been present alongside the Roman guards at the tomb of Jesus). All that science can say after twenty-five years is that the seers are physically and psychologically healthy, and that the seers had a deep-seated and far-reaching experience which continues to affect them to this very day, one that it is impossible to deduce from their biographies. All of that is, for the visionaries, a holy treasure. For that reason one must exclude a purely human cause, and, by the same token, one that is demonic, inasmuch as the Devil is unable to yield good fruit that is constant and so long lasting.

Since twenty-five years have elapsed, a review sine ira et studio (without rancor and diligent attention) would be expedient, both in the local Church and the Church at large, as to the fruits which have been given and continue to be given through Mary’s apparitions beyond all ideological suppositions and prejudices. When observed from the purely statistical point of view as a whole, close to some fifty thousand priest have passed through Medjugorje, hundreds of bishops, cardinals, and millions upon millions of the faithful. The Una Sancta et Catholica (the One Holy and Catholic [Church]) in miniature comes to pass here every day. Were there something to be found heretical, schismatic, or contrary to Church teaching, the Church would be obliged to undertake measures against such abuse. That has not resulted up to the present. Therefore, a fifteen-year ad experimentum period since the Zadar Pronouncement in 1991 is a sufficient amount of time so as to allow to conclude that no straying from official Church teaching and practice is taking place in Medjugorje. The Liturgy and devotions celebrated there are fully Christological, Marian, Eucharistic, sacramental, and in full harmony with Church regulations.

It cannot be asserted that the particular fruits of Medjugorje are those of intensive prayer and administration of the sacraments. To do so would be to create a circulus vitiosus (vicious circle): there are other places in the world where prayer and the sacraments are a fixed practice; however, what is lacking there are the efficacious effects that we note as attributable to Medjugorje. It is clear that prayer and the sacraments bear copious fruits for the entire Church throughout the world; however, from where and why do so many people come precisely to Medjugorje? Why do they come to this remote place where they have a concrete experience of God and grace, are converted, learn to pray, and subsequently carry the fruits of Medjugorje to their homes, give witness to what they have experienced, and become missionaries? It simply is not possible to separate the assertions of the seers regarding the apparitions from the fruits of the apparitions which we see in the Church.

The consensus fidei et fidelium can be seen by the fact that all levels of God’s people, all classes in society and the Church, all peoples, and all races are represented in Medjugorje, and by the fact that Church life is sustained by all of this in the form of witness, divine worship, sincere service, charity, (martyria, liturgia, et diakonia), and, by the fact that all grow in holiness. Medjugorje is a world-wide phenomenon. Its fruits can be seen in all parts of the world. In essence, Medjugorje is a laymen’s movement, a movement of faithful laymen, laden with spirituality, devotion, and sincerity toward the Lord and our Lady. The seers themselves are ordinary lay people and, as such, are able more readily to touch the hearts of plain folks who easily identify with them.

Medjugorje is a peace and pilgrimage movement inasmuch as people come here for the sake of inner peace. It is also a renewal movement within the Church – Ecclesia semper reformanda (the Church ever to be renewed), as well as a humanitarian movement, inasmuch as it has accomplished tremendous charitable and Samaritan works throughout the world (a point made by the present Pope in his encyclical on the God of Love). Lumen Gentium (The Vatican II Document: Light of the Nations) clearly states: “Be they most illustrious, be they simple and more widespread, Charisms are useful and are especially suited to the needs of the Church and must be received with gratitude and consolidation.” (LG 12:2) Meanwhile, Apostolicam Actuositatem (Apostolic Activity) states even more explicitly: “The receipt of Charisms, even those that are humble, give rise to the right and duty for each of the faithful to make use of them in the Church and in the world and for the good of mankind and the growth of the Church in the freedom of the Holy Ghost.” (AA 3:3).

After the past quarter of a century, it can be asserted that Medjugorje is about a prophetic Charism – a prophetic revelation that calls for repentance. These Charisms are able to be found in all similar phenomena within the Church. Prophetic revelations and apparitions are about an imperative under the impetus of the Holy Spirit as to how one is to behave here and now, and what it is that the People of God must do in a specific situation. Accordingly, the Church must not relate to such phenomena indifferently. She is duty-bound to investigate such an imperative with openness and, congruently, to act if she recognizes the Will of God in the said phenomenon. It is obvious that the Ecclesia orans (the praying Church) has recognized God’s Will and Mary’s presence in this instance, of which our dearly departed Pope John Paul II spoke in his homily in Zadar (!) three years prior, on the feast of Mary, the Mother of the Church (Pentecost Monday, 2003). On that occasion, the Pope specifically mentioned the above cited sensus fidei fidelium (the understanding of faith of the faithful).

If, as is the case with ordinary beatifications and canonizations, the process begins with the local Church, and, after an appropriate interval of time, investigation, and conclusions based on the materials offered in favor of beatification or canonization, the matter is transferred to Rome, I think that would be appropriate in this case. After all has been investigated at the local level, the entire case of the Medjugorje phenomenon should be transferred to the appropriate Roman dicastery, especially in light of the fact that it has outgrown the local Church’s boundaries and has become widespread so as to encompass the entire Church. The countless prayer groups throughout the entire world have come into existence because of the events in Medjugorje. They carry the mark of authenticity and veracity. The entire phenomenon is caught-up in the very being of the Church and, as such, carries more weight than does a beatification of one of God’s chosen ones. If, as is the case for beatification, the People of God are asked their approval, why shouldn’t we do so in this case as well, especially in light of Mary’s efficacious presence in specific places (John Paul II, in Zadar!), and in light of the personal experiences and miracles that individuals experienced precisely here in Medjugorje?

Throughout the entire history of Salvation, God has established communication with his creatures through apparitions. This form of communication is especially suitable for man’s physico-spiritual structure: it immerses man’s senses, especially his sight and hearing. The Medjugorje phenomenon can be explained in this manner or that manner; however, intellectual honesty demands that the entire affair engage us in light of revelation, mysticism, supernatural experiences and so many other similar experiences in other cases, and, for that matter, in other faiths.

If God has truly spoken throughout history, why should we be exempted from such a manner of communication wherein the Holy Ghost makes use of apparitions for the sake of the many needs of the contemporary world? The greater the misery in the world, so much the greater is the need for God’s voice and communication. Hence, we might well conclude as did Paul: Do not extinguish the spirit. Do not disdain prophetic communications. Investigate all and hold on to what is good! (1 Thess. 5:19-21).

Medjugorje, July 13, 2006

從教宗和教會立塲看默主哥耶的顯現

尹雅白神父

自我在公教報發表了一篇有關往默主哥耶朝聖的感想之後,曾在網上看到一些批評的文章。於是使我有機會再深入研究該事件的前因後果,並能看出事件令人有不同的意見的原因,原來是出於當地主教的一個禁令否認聖母顯現的事實而來。現在我要把這事件做出正確的回應,為能顯示出默主哥耶的真象與真理,好能使讀者得到一個全面的認知與評價!

首先讓我們看看默主哥耶所屬的教區叫莫士達(Mostar),當時的主教名叫山力(Zanic)。這位主教於一九八零年被委任為該教區主教,當一九八一年聖母顯現初期,他是熱烈的擁護者,曾五次到訪默主哥耶的聖雅各伯堂。當年七月二十五日堂區主保瞻禮,他曾被邀請在聖雅各伯堂主持感恩聖祭,他在彌撒中講道時,向世界宣佈他的信念說:「六位這樣單純的兒童,假如是受人操縱,半小時之內便會和盤托出。我向大家保證,沒有神父做過這樣事… ,而且我深信這些孩子不是撒謊…,有一件事十分肯定:某些東西在推動人心,告解、祈禱、敵人互相修和…,這是向前邁進的步伐,餘下來的,我們交給聖母瑪利亞,交給耶穌。終有一天,教會必定就此事作出評價。」

莫士達主教與方濟各會士的關係:如要研究莫士達山力主教為什麼會反對承認聖母在默主哥耶的顯現,可以說是因為他與方濟各會士的關係惡化有關。教會中許多惡表是從人事關係開始,因為有一些長上在有權有勢時,就不顧一切把牧民作為自己權力的手段,因而造成了教會的許多悲劇。

事情的發生是這樣的:當時的默主哥耶自一八九二年就由方濟各會神父負責管理牧民工作,一向都很順利。山力主教上任不久便更換轄下教區人事,大事調動,把默主哥耶聖雅各伯堂的方濟各會神父全部調走,因此使當時的教友與方濟各會都感憤慨。山力主教更全無理由之下,革除了兩名深受教友愛戴擁護的年青會士,因此引起更大的衝突,使教友對山力主教更加不滿。而山力主教從那時開始,竟然成為堅決反對默主哥耶的敵人。

一九八三年七月初,聖母對神視者要求他們為主教每星期守齋兩天,每天為主教祈禱。山力主教於一九九三年因健康理由退休,他的接任主教柏力克(Peric)與他同一陣線,反對更甚。他承認從未和任何神視者對話,亦表明他不相信任何聖母顯現,包括露德和花地蒂瑪的顯現,他也不相信。教會竟然會有這樣的主教,我們也不應奇怪,希望天主寬恕他們,聖母原諒他們!在教會的歷史中,這一類的主教為數也不少。從這一點也可以看出,教會是罪人的教會,但教會是聖的,教會有聖化一切人的使命。即使是主教神父,甚至教宗也會犯罪。我們的責任就是順聽聖母的勸告,為教會祈禱,為教會的神職人員祈禱,每天要為教宗、主教和神父祈禱!因為他們都是軟弱的受造物,他們會受到誘惑,受到魔鬼強烈的試探,正如耶穌在傳教以前四十天嚴齋中都受到魔鬼的試探一樣。

默主哥耶受當地主教攻擊,照理說不會再有人前往朝聖了,但事實恰好相反,前往朝聖的人愈來愈多,每年都吸引了三四十多萬人前往祈禱、悔改修和及做補贖刻苦的工作,因為每次爬上聖母顯現山及十字苦路山,都要經過艱苦的跋涉,才能上到滿佈亂石的路途。

事情既然發生了,教廷當然不會置之不理,因此許多樞機主教、總主教及一般教區主教都前往默主哥耶。根據最近由Denis Nolan – 羅南旦尼斯所著的“默主哥耶與教會”一書所載,已有四百多位主教前往默主哥耶考察與祈禱。其中有七位樞機,四十三位總主教,而神父的人數在該書出版時(2006年)就已有七萬之多,他們的意見都是積極的,正面的,對聖母顯現的事都表示肯定。

單從以上的紀錄,已經使我們驚訝,聖母在默主哥耶的工作是多麼偉大,同時也得到教廷當局作出了適當的處理。從一九八六年起,教廷取消由山力主教成立的調查委員會,而委任南斯拉夫國主教團組織一個新的調查委員會,由樞機主教領導,教廷並禁止山力主教參與其事,這樣事實已很清晰。教廷的調查至今進行已經二十三年,並未停止。

一九九八年五月二十六日教廷信理部,當時的部長為拉辛格樞機,也就是現任教宗本篤十六世,經由秘書柏通(Tarcisio Bertone)發出信函答覆Gilbert Aubry主教有關默主哥耶的問題 (信件檔案:Pr.No.154/81-06419而信件原文能在網絡上找到:Children of Medjugorje.com) 內容摘要共分四點:

一‧莫士達教區主教的聲明只反映他自己的意見,不是教會的正式宣佈,並不需要教友的同意與服從。

二‧對默主哥耶事件的調查還在繼續進行。負責照顧教友的神職人員伴同參加牧靈朝聖是許可的。

三‧教廷會成立一個新的調查委員會負責默主哥耶的顯現。

四‧私人朝聖者可以完全服從教會的指示到默主哥耶參加一切活動。

若望保祿二世現在我要將教宗若望保祿二世對默主哥耶事件的言論記錄於下,他雖然未能代表教會正式宣佈使默主哥耶聖母顯現的事蹟如同露德及花蒂瑪一樣,但在他的私人書信和談話中,已表達了足夠的理由,使我們可以完全放心。前往朝聖聆聽聖母的訊息是因為聖母的慈愛在不斷關懷我們,勸勉我們,要求我們悔改、祈禱、守齋克己,她所要求於我們的就是這些。而這些善工是今日許多教友與神職人員所疏忽了的!

教宗若望保祿二世於一九八四年說:「默主哥耶是花蒂瑪的延續。」一九八七年教宗接見了神視者密欣娜(Mirjana)說:「如果我不是教宗,我已在默主哥耶領修和聖事了。」一九八八年對巴西的基加主教說:「默主哥耶,默主哥耶,它是世界的靈性中心。」一九八九年對一群義大利醫生說:「是的,今天這世界對超自然的事物已失去感覺。在默主哥耶,許多人在祈禱,守齋和領修和聖事之中,尋找到和重新發現到超性的意識。」

一九九零年南韓主教團主席金男淑總主教晉見教宗時有一段對話,可以看到若望保祿二世的立場是多麼明顯。金主教稱讚教宗說:「聖父,感謝你,全因為你,波蘭才得以從共產主義的政權中解放出來。」教宗回答說:「不,這不是我的功勞,這是榮福童貞瑪利亞的工作,她早已在花蒂瑪和默主哥耶作出了預言。」可見教宗已把聖母在默主哥耶的顯現與花蒂瑪相提並論,等量齊觀了!

一九九六年八月十五日聖母蒙召升天節,基爾柏歐布理主教(Gilbert Aubry Bishop of St. Denis – reunion Island) 作證說:「默主哥耶!聖母在這地方顯現至今達十五年之久未曾斷過。看見聖母顯現的人仍繼續看見她,並領受她的信息。教會對此事尚無斷語,而是以謹慎及開放的精神等待著考察的結果。

假如這一切是魔鬼的傑作,那會怎樣呢?這魔鬼真是個可憐虫,令人婉惜,牠大規模的率領自己的嘍囉,中了自己所設的詭計,真是自作自受!何以如此呢?因為在默主哥耶所發生的一切事件,是把迷失在人生旅途的靈魂帶返天父家,是為恢復世界上唯一的真正和平 —-天主恩賜的和平。

那麼這「巴爾干半島的童貞瑪利亞」不是講的太多了嗎?這話是對那些無羞愧感兼懷疑事實者的諷刺。他們有眼但看不見,有耳却聽不見嗎?默主哥耶信息的聲音清晰地告訴人們,那是一位充滿母愛及堅強女人的聲音,她不溺愛她的孩子,但教誨、勸告、鼓勵他們,努力上進,為我們地球的未來命運負起更大的責任:「以後大部份要發生的事情的好壞,就在乎我們的祈禱了。」

但是要怎樣的祈禱呢?不是像背死書式的喃喃而語,而是生氣勃勃並喜樂的祈禱!是表達願意自我犧牲和克己的祈禱,跟隨救主耶穌的腳步,渴望世界甦醒的祈禱!聖母召喚我們要因聖神的氣息,徹底悔改,換一顆新心:我們必須學習真實地度信德的生活,“不是只在嘴唇上或腦海裡,而是以善表。”這並不是新的信息,可是迫使我們付諸實行的上愛天主下愛近人的新誡命的緊急情況是新的。它們是不能分開的。在我們生活中所有的層面都需要改變。

Medjugorje, The 90’s這就是“默主哥耶的信息”,和「聖母聖心的勝利」遺留在我心中最重要的部份。厄瑪奴耳修女給我們寫了一本有力的書 (Medjugorje, The 90’s),激發我們在復活節前夕重宣領洗誓願的記憶:就是棄絕魔鬼,和它的行為,並要遵守天主的聖言,以及信經中的字句,圓滿地活出聖事的真實 — 總而言之,藉著守齋和誦念玫瑰經,過真正的生活!

我們必須讓天主在他願意的任何時候,在昨天、今天和將來永遠長存的天主面前,把世界的時間和空間變容。天主是人類的宏願。天主在我們的這個時代,以徵兆和奇蹟,在耶穌與瑪利亞心心相印的親密中,自己重新確定了天主聖神的工程。在這本書中的一些見證,令我感動到流淚。願它為讀者成為聖寵的一個泉源。親愛的讀者,我的訊息是,祈禱,與人修和,愛人並具體行動。

我在我的教區內,看見到一些教友,在默主哥耶與聖母愛的關懷接觸之後,表現幡然一新。而我本人,在聽從內心的驅使之後,也願意親自去接觸這恩寵的泉源—默主哥耶。

Krizevac 十字山於是在一個仲冬的季節,我便帶著我二十年來做主教的沉重包袱,靜悄悄地來到了默主哥耶。我求主寬恕我的缺點,並感謝上主。我攀登Krizevac山時,有時爬山,淚流滿面。在我胸膛內敲打著那種溫良和謙卑的心聲,我感覺我已不是過去的我了—我主我天主,那不再是我了。五十三歲那年,我離開了默主哥耶,帶著一顆充滿活力的心和新精神,滿腔熱火,欣然地為福傳事業作好準備,同時也把我帶到九霄雲外:所有的一切都是喜樂和希望,同瑪利亞渴望正義及和平。今天我作見證。

為此,這本書在默主哥耶的檔案中是一份重要的文件。它是對我們一種清晰響亮的召喚,召叫我們作內心的悔改。感謝天主!我靈讚頌上主!」

當我們看完教宗、主教及教廷的申明之後,相信讀者已經可以很清楚了解在默主哥耶所發生的事。因為聖母顯現的事件沒有結束,而教廷仍在繼續觀察調查,故此未能正式宣佈及承認。我們應該懷著開放的心,具有謙虛的態度來接受這項事實的存在。我說的存在事實,是那麼多的樞機主教、神父、修士、修女及數百萬教友已到過默主哥耶朝聖祈禱了,他們中很多都已悔改更新作補贖克己守齋了,為什麼還有些人懷著敵視仇恨的態度來攻擊默主哥耶呢?我以為最好的解決辦法,是不要再批評攻擊,而是希望他們親身去體驗一下默主哥耶的實際情況,則一切疑慮都會冰釋了!

最後,我願藉著這篇文章,向一切讀者呼籲,聽聽聖母在露德,在花蒂瑪和默主哥耶的慈母心聲是不會錯的!

信義教理聖部 Pr. No.154/81-06419

一 九 九 八 年 五 月 二 十 五 日致 Gilbert Aubry 主教Saint Denis de la Reunion 主教

尊座鈞鑒:
在您一九九八年正月一日呈上本聖部幾個有關默主哥耶所謂聖母顯現,私人朝聖以及為朝聖者提供的牧靈照顧一事,對聖座和Mostar主教的立場。

對這件事,我認為答覆您的每一個問題是不可能的。我所願意指出的主要事情是聖座平常沒有以本身的立場對這假設的超性現象當作初審法庭。至於問題中的顯現可信度,本聖部重視在一九九一年四月十日前南斯拉夫主教們的Zadar宣言所決定:根據調查迄今為止的事實來說,它不能斷定一個人和超性的顯現及啟示有來往。因為南斯拉夫分裂成許多不同的獨立國家之故,所以如今適合Bosnia-Herzegovina 的主教團到時從新展開調查案件,並宣佈任何需要的新聲明。

Peric 主教在他致給基督信徒家庭總秘書的信中所聲明的 : “我的立場及意見是,在默主哥耶的顯現和啟示不是超性的事實。” 這只是應該認為是Mostar 主教的個人定斷,因為他是當時正權主教,有發表聲明的權利,不過他所宣佈的只是他自己個人的意見,而且教會當局將要查考此事。

最後,至於私人組織到默主哥耶朝聖一事,本聖部指出他們被准許去朝聖,條件是他們不要看作尚在調查的事件當作為真的証明,而且它還要求教會去審查。我希望至少對尊座呈遞給本聖部所提出的問題得到滿意的答覆,並請尊座接受我心意的表明。

Tarcisio Bertone  總 主 教

Ratzinger 樞 機 主 教 主 持 的 ”聖部” 秘 書 *

上 述 摘 要 :

一. Mostar 的主教所發表的聲明只反映他自己本人意見。他的意見不是教會的正式的宣佈,並不 需要信友同意和服從。
二. Zadar 的宣言給人指出,對默主哥耶未來的審查大門還在敞開。此際牧靈照顧的神職人員伴 同私人朝聖是許可的。
三. 一個新的調查團最終會被委任。
四. 目前私人朝聖者可以完全服從教會的指示去默主哥耶朝聖。

附注 *
此信件的原文能在網絡上找到:  ChildrenofMedjugorje.com

信仰教義聖部對默主哥耶的澄清

為默主哥耶的這件事,信仰們的争論和不安已經太久了。但在一九九八年信理教義聖部給所有願意知道教會的正式立場的信友們一個清楚的解答。

Aubry 主教在一九九八年正月致函給 Ratzinger 樞機主教,呈上一些對默主哥耶牧靈的看法所棌取的態度和基本問題。我們能曉得下列事項:
– Mostar 教區主教自一九八六年起就不再主管默主哥耶的文檔。
– 教會叫我們去查一九九一年 Zadar 宣言。
– 宣言說明可以去默主哥耶作私人朝聖。
– 教會沒有發表決定性的聲明。她保持開放為作更充份的研究。 因為這些陳述不在所有信友手中,某些反對默主哥耶者假借服從教會之名,譴責聖母的顯現和所有朝聖者。

以下是 Schonborn 樞機主教之評論:

Bertone 總主教致La Reunion 主教的信對教會高層人物在最近幾年有關默主哥耶事件的立場够清楚了,就是,教會明智有意地對這事件懸而未決。 超自然的特性不成立 ;  如 同前南斯拉夫主教團於一九九一年在  Zadar

所用的字句。那實際是字眼的事,明智地使它懸而未獲決。它沒有說超自然的特性真實的成立。再一說,它也沒有否認或懷疑這現象可能是超自然性質的。無疑地,教會的權威層沒有作出決定性的宣言,當這奇異現象以顯現或其它方式還在發生的時候。的確,那是牧人的使命去促進甚麼正在成長,鼓勵出現的良果,假使需要的話保護它不受各處有明顯的危險。

在露德也許需要留意,不要把露德的原裝禮物被不幸的發展窒息了。默主哥耶也不是不易受攻擊的。這就是為甚麼在現實或將來對主教們為默主哥耶所牧放的羊群是那樣的重要。他們在牧函發表的,要盡力保護好樹明顯的果實,而不受可能的不幸發展。

我相信聖母在加納婚宴上所說的話 : “ 你們要作任何他所吩咐你們作的,”來彌補她對這些世紀所說的實質。瑪利亞幫助我們聽從耶穌,她以全心全力渴望我們作她聖子告訴我們要作的。

這就是我對默主哥耶成立的祈禱團體的願望;這就是我對我們的教區和教會所希冀的。

我本人沒有親自去過默主哥耶,但是我以一種方式藉着那些曾去過默主哥耶我所認識的人,或遇見的人也去過默主哥耶,在他們的生活中我看到了善果。如果我說這些善果不存在的話,那麼我就在說謊。這些果實是具體的,有形的。我能在我的教區內和許多別的地方看到悔改的恩寵,令人回到聖事 辦告解的恩寵。所有的這一切,不會誤導人。所以對我來說,身為主教,我只能看到果實。如果我們以結出的果實來判斷樹的好壞的話,我應該說好樹結好果,而這樹結最好的果實。

Schonborn 樞機主教
Schonborn 樞機主教是維也納的總主教,在一九九八年四旬期給教宗和他的全體管家講避靜,他也是 ‟ 天主教教理"的主要著作者。而且他於一九九八年七月十八日在露德給予史無前例的見証。樞機主教的見証已在‟Medjugorje Gebetsaksion”,#50刊出(在樞機主教的准許下英語譯文版已發行)。

一位主教對默主哥耶的見証

默主哥耶!聖母在這地方顯現至今達十五年之久未曾間斷過。看見聖母顯現的人仍繼續看見她,並領受她的信息。教會對此事尚無斷語,而是以謹慎及開放的精神等待着考察的結果。

假如這一切是魔鬼的傑作,那麼怎樣呢﹖這魔鬼真是個可憐蟲,令人婉惜,他不單剜自己的臭腳,而且是大規模的率領自己的嘍囉,中了自己所設的詭計,真是自作自受!何以如此呢?因為在默主哥耶所發生的一切事件是把迷失在人生旅途的靈魂帶返天父家,是為恢復世界上唯一的真正和平 ── 天主恩賜的和平。

那麼這“巴爾幹半島的童貞瑪利亞”不是講的太多了嗎?這話是對那些無羞愧感兼懷疑事實者的諷刺。他們有眼但看不見,有耳卻聽不見嗎?默主哥耶信息的聲音清晰地告訴人們,那是一位充滿母愛及堅強女人的聲音,她不溺愛她的孩子,但教誨、勸告、鼓勵他們,努力上進,為我們地球的未來命運負起更大的責任:“以後大部份要發生的事情的好壞,就在乎我們的祈禱了。”

但是要怎樣的祈禱呢?不是像背死書式的喃喃而語,而是生氣勃勃並喜樂的祈禱!是表達願意自我犠牲和克己的祈禱,跟隨救主耶穌的腳步,渴望世界蘇醒的祈禱!聖母召喚我們要因聖神等氣息,徹底悔改,換一顆新心:我們必須學習真實地度信徳的生活,“不是只在嘴唇上或腦海裏,而是以善表。”這並不是新的信息,可是迫使我們付諸實行的,上愛天主下愛近人的新誡命的緊急情況是新的。它們是不能分開的。在我們生活中所有的層面都需要改變。

這就是“默主哥耶的信息”,和“聖母聖心的勝利”遺留在我心中最重要的部分。厄馬奴耳修女給我們寫了一本有力的書,激發我們在復活節前夕重宣領洗誓願的記憶:就是棄絕魔鬼,和它的行為,並要遵守天主的聖言,以及信經中的字句,圓滿地活出聖事的真實 ── 總而言之,藉着守齋和誦唸玫瑰經,過真正的生活。

我們必須讓天主在祂願意的任何時候,在昨天,今天和將來永遠長存的天主面前,把世界的時間和空間變容。天主是人類的宏願。天主在我們的這個時代,以征兆和奇蹟,在耶穌與瑪利亞心心相印的親密中,自己重新確定了天主聖神的工程。在這本書中等一些見証,令我感動到流淚。願它為讀者成為聖寵的一個泉源。親愛的讀者,我的訊息是,祈禱,與人修和,愛人並具體行動。

我在我的教區內,看見到一些教友,在默主哥耶與聖母愛的關懷接觸之後,表現煥然一新。而我本人,在聽從內心的驅使之后,也願意親自去接觸這恩寵的泉源 ── 默主哥耶。

於是在一個初冬的季節,我便帶着我二十年來做主教的沉重包袱,靜悄悄地來到了默主哥耶。我求主寬恕我的缺點,並感謝上主。我攀登Krizevac山時,有時爬行,淚流滿面。在我胸膛內敲打着那種溫良和謙卑的心聲,我感覺我已不是過去的我了──我主我天主,那不再是我了。五十三歲那年,我離開了默主哥耶,帶着一顆充滿活力的心和新精神,滿腔熱火,欣然地為福傳事業作好準備,同時也把我帶到九霄雲外:所有的一切都是喜樂和希望,同瑪利亞渴望正義及和平。今天我作見証。

為此,這本書在默主哥耶的檔案中是一份重要的文件。它是對我們一種清晰嚮亮的召喚,召叫我們作內心的悔改。感謝天主!我靈讚頌上主!

Monsignor Gilbert Aubry
Bishop of St. Denis (reunion Island)
寫於一九九六年八月十五日
聖母蒙召升天節
以上資料摘錄自Medjugorje, the 90’s by Sister Emmanuel

對默主哥耶的不同看法

自1981年6月25日開始,聖母不停地每天顯現於默主哥耶,但這個神聖之地,到27年後的今天仍然存在很多關於聖母顯現的疑問和爭議,其中原因是由於當地主教的極力反對和不斷發出言論,否認顯現的真確性,讓我們考究一下:

默主哥耶堂區是屬於波斯尼亞霧市達Mostar教區所管轄的。山力Zanic主教在1980年9月顯現開始前一年,他剛上任霧市達主教一職,在顯現之初,他是熱烈的擁護者,頭數星期,他五次探訪此堂區,可見他關注之情。當年7日25日聖雅各伯堂之主保瞻禮,山力主教被當時任職本堂神父的 Fr.Jozo邀請前去奉獻感恩祭,於講道時,他向世界宣佈他的信念:他說:⌈六位這樣單純的兒童,假如是受人操縱,半小時便會和盤托出了。我向大家保証,沒有神父做過這樣事……而且我深信這些孩子不是撒謊……..有一件事十分肯定的:某種東西在推動人心,告解,祈禱,敵人互相修和……這是向前邁進最佳步伐,餘下來的我們必須交給聖母瑪利亞,交給耶穌。終有一天,教會必會就此事作出評價⌋。這些言論確實發自山力主教,這一位後來竟視聖母顯現是方濟各會士所做出來的騙局的極力反對者,多麼可惜,原因可在?

由於山力主教上任不久便更換轄下教區人手,他任命非修會神職人員去取代方濟各會士自1892年已擔任聖雅各伯堂區的エ作,許多方濟各會士和大部份堂區教友都甚感憤慨,有些方濟各會士在教友力請下仍繼續留任服務,主教得知方濟各會士不服從命令,便決定殺雞警猴,革除了兩名深得人心的年青神父的神職身份,因而引起了主教與堂區教友及方濟各會士的紛爭。而後來村民請神視者去問聖母有關這件事,據神視者稱:聖母說主教「誤聽」讒言,給人「誤導」,應「重新」考慮革除無辜的年青方濟各會神父一事,就是這樣,山力主教聽見這據稱是童貞瑪利亞的意見時,大嚷:「天主之母絕不會這樣跟一位主教說話的!」從那一刻開始,他成了顯現的堅決敵人。

關於山力主教的反對,在1983年7月1日聖母顯現時對神視者說:⌈要一星期守齋兩天,意向是為主教,他承擔著一個很沉重的責任,如果有需要,我會要求你們守齋三天,每天要為主教祈禱⌋。在1984年7月20日聖母晚上在顯現山對神視者說:⌈向我開放你們的心,走近我,大聲說出你們的意向和祈禱。⌋ 聖母十分留心神視者的祈禱,當為霧市達山力主教祈禱時,聖母的眼睛充滿著淚水,她說:⌈你們是我的小花朵,繼續祈禱;我的任務是燃點亮光。⌋然後聖母用十字架祝福神視者及在場的人,並哭泣著升回天堂。

在1982年1月山力主教成立4人委員會研究默主哥耶事蹟,兩年後再成立14人新委員會調查,山力主教自我委任為委員會會長兼主席,他的宣言紀錄在案:他會粉碎顯現這傳說。1986年4月,他親訪羅馬,呈上初步調查所得,散佈顯現實屬虛構的謠言。當時教廷信理部部長若瑟.賴辛格樞機主教(即現任教宗本篤十六世),並不同意他的調查方法,後來更史無前例地,梵蒂岡解散了山力主教的14人委員會,因此自1986年起霧市達教區主教就不再主管默主哥耶的案件。教廷重新組織調查團,新委員由南斯拉夫全體主教組成,由南斯拉夫樞機領導。並只有他們,受權成立新的顯現研究,研究完成以後,他們將向教宗正式提交建議書。同時,新委員會著手搜集証據,但需費時數年,期間,教廷宣示霧市達主教該保持緘默,不該再介入顯現事件。這行動是發生在22年前由教會官方決定,而現在仍然是生效。

1993年山力主教因健康問題而退休,他安排了Peric主教接替他的職務,可惜 Peric主教對默主哥耶事件的負面批評比山力主教更甚,這位霧市達教區的主教承認,他從未和任何神視者對話,亦表明他不相信任何的聖母顯現,包括在花地瑪和露德。雖然,霧市達教區的主教不友善地對待方濟各會的神父,但神父們只是靜默地聽從。而主教曾三次在對國際公教報的訪問中表明: ⌈我希望摧毀默主哥耶⌋。

1998年1月1日,一位主教GilbertAubry致函信理教義聖部,表達對默主哥耶事件的看法及提出問題,希望知道教會的正式立場。而在 1998年5月25日,由當時主持信理部的賴辛格樞機主教(即現任教宗本篤十六世),經由他的秘書Bertone總主教(現任樞機主教)簽署了正式指引, 對霧市達的主教所發表的聲明說在默主哥耶的顯現和啟示不是超性事實,這只是反映他自己本人意見,他的意見不是教會的正式宣布,并不需要信友同意和服從。

1991年4月10日前南斯拉夫主教們在會議中聲明他們未曾確定顯現的超自然性,但他們亦沒有否認或懷疑這現象可能是超自然性質的,這是由於調查仍在進行中,再次証明霧市達教區主教是錯誤反映顯現的事件。而1991年的Zadar宣言給人指出,對默主哥耶未來的審查大門仍敞開。正式接受默主哥耶為一個祈禱場所,並批准作為一個敬禮中心,此際牧靈照顧的神職人員伴同私人朝聖是許可的。目前私人朝聖者可以完全服從教會的指示去默主哥耶朝聖。有關信件的原文可在網絡 ChildrenOfMedjugorje.com找到,也可查閱教廷文件檔案 No.154/81-06419.

梵蒂岡教廷已清楚指示:私人提出而非官方組織的朝聖是准許的。這並不是針對默主哥耶而言,教廷的指引是:任何地方在接受正式確認前,不會允許舉辦官方的朝聖。正如在1858年,當時組織正式朝聖團到露德是不可以的,直至聖母顯現給伯爾納德正式為教廷所接納。由於默主哥耶的顯現尚未完結,教廷是不會作任何的決定,也沒有發表決定性的聲明,但這並不影響它的真確性,教會保持開放為作充份的研究。而且官方人仕表明私人朝聖團,實際上是有助教廷作出適當的裁決,因為如果沒有人到默主哥耶便沒有理據去作出調查。

大部份對現代的聖母顯現最初都會被教會質疑。花地瑪在顯現完結後13年才被承認。在露德聖母顯現之初亦受到強烈的評擊,甚至認為是魔鬼的エ作,當聖母出現,她的反對者撒殫亦是全力的臨在。魔鬼的主要勝利是要使到它的維護者成為聖神的主要敵人,而那些反對默主哥耶的人,常假借教會之名,譴責聖母的顯現和所有朝聖者,誤導很多對事情不了解的人。其實只要客觀去分析,都會看到默主哥耶帶來的美好成果:朝聖者重整信仰生活,悔改更新,重視祈禱,把天主放在首位,沒有任何抵觸教會的訓示,而聖母的訊息完全吻合聖經和天主教的承傳。所以有機會應親自去默主哥耶觀察,接觸,就不會誤聽或受誤導。

另一方面,在ニ十世紀於屬靈領域最偉大的三個辨別者:教宗若望保祿ニ世,德蘭修女和Fr.GabrieleAmorth都承認默主哥耶聖母顯現的真確性,Fr.GabrieleAmorth說默主哥耶是抵抗撒殫最強大的堡壘。(他是羅馬教區的正式驅魔神父,他曾作過三十萬以上的驅魔個案) 。

教宗若望保祿ニ世更是默主哥耶的熱切支持者,我們不單止在很多主教和樞機主教的見証中可得知,我們亦有教宗的親筆書信去証實。教宗寫道:每天他像一個朝聖者向默主哥耶祈禱。他在1984年對軒尼主教說:⌈默主哥耶是花地瑪的延續⌋。 1987年對神視者蜜欣娜說:⌈如果我不是教宗,我已在默主哥耶領修和聖事了。⌋1988年對巴西的基加主教說:⌈默主哥耶,默主哥耶:它是世界的靈性之心。⌋1989年在義大利對一群醫生說:⌈是的,今天,這世界對超自然的事物已失去了感知。在默主哥耶,許多人在祈禱、守齋和領修和聖事之中,尋找到和重新發現到這意識。⌋1990年韓國主教團主席金男淑總主教稱讚教宗說:⌈聖父,感謝你,全因為你,波蘭才得以從共產主義的政權中解放出來。⌋教宗回答說:⌈不,這不是我的功勞,這是榮福童貞瑪利亞的エ作,她早已在花地瑪和默主哥耶作出預言。⌋1992年對旭素神父說:⌈要為默主哥耶鞠躬盡瘁,看顧默主哥耶,不要倦怠,要持之以恆,要堅強,我與你同在,保護默主哥耶,跟隨默主哥耶。⌋1994年對巴拉奎班迪斯總主教說:⌈凡與默主哥耶有關的全部都予以批准。⌋1997年支亞維拉的加華主教詢問教宗是否相信默主哥耶,教宗回答三次說:⌈我相信….我相信….我相信….。⌋

自1981年以來已有三千萬的信眾,三萬多的神父,數百位主教和樞機主教曾到默主哥耶作私人的朝聖,默主哥耶聖母顯現確實吸引不少人。聖母在 2000年2月25日說:⌈從不信與罪惡的睡夢中醒來吧,因為這是天主賜給你們的恩寵時期,利用這個時期,向天主尋求醫治心靈的恩寵,好讓你們以心來看天主,以心來看人。⌋在2004年1月25日聖母說:⌈小孩子們,特別為那些還來認識天主愛情的人祈禱,祈求他們的心靈敞開,靠近我和我聖子耶穌的聖心,好讓我們能夠把他們轉化,成為平安與愛情的子民。⌋讓我們特別為那些不接受默主哥耶聖母顯現的人多加祈禱和守齋。

在2001年6月25日聖母顯現20週年,聖母說:⌈天主賜給你們奇妙偉大的恩寵,所以,小孩子們,請善加利用這時期的恩寵,靠近一點我的心,好令我能領你們到我聖子耶穌那裡 。⌋

在1997年8月25日聖母說:⌈天主賜我這段時間,作為你們的禮物,好讓我教導你們,帶領你們走上救贖的道路。親愛的孩子們,現在你們領略不到這個恩寵,但時候快要來臨,你們將要為這些訊息追悔。⌋期望所有的人都醒覺、體會、珍惜這個恩寵時刻,不要等到時候來臨才去追悔。

在2002年6月25日聖母顯現21週年,聖母說:⌈今天,我為你們祈禱,並與你們一起祈求聖神的幫助,增加你們的信德,好讓你們能進一步接受我在這神聖的地方所發佈的訊息。小孩子們,你們知道,這是給你們每一個人的恩寵時期。小孩子們,與我相偕,你們便得到安穩,我渴望領你們眾人走上聖善的道路。生活我的訊息,把我所說的每一句話都融入生命之中。願你們珍惜我的話語, 因為它們是來自天堂的。⌋

資料來源:綜合報導